Chat log from the meeting on 2020-05-12

[10:59] Ubit Umarov: hi wihite gavin.Hird
[10:59] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: Hi
[11:00] Ubit Umarov: hi everyone
[11:00] Andrew Hellershanks: Hello, everyone.
[11:00] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: evening everyone
[11:00] Selby.Evans @grid.kitely.com:8002: Hi everyone
[11:02] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: Today, May 12 I woke up to snow
[11:02] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: it has been snowing all the way from 58 deg north tom 72 deg north
[11:03] Selby.Evans @grid.kitely.com:8002: was 70 in North Texas
[11:03] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: Hi Kayaker and Popstar
[11:04] Kayaker Magic: Arielle, you are invisible to me!
[11:04] Arielle Popstar: Hi Gavin
[11:04] Arielle Popstar: Hi Kayaker
[11:04] Arielle Popstar: slow loading i guess
[11:04] Selby.Evans @grid.kitely.com:8002: Hi Kayaker, Arialle
[11:04] Kayaker Magic: Yeah, here come some random prims
[11:04] Arielle Popstar: Hi Selby
[11:05] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: Actually it is the first time she has aver loaded properly for me. Usually she is partly grey
[11:05] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: ever*
[11:05] Arielle Popstar: have to make sure the load is distributed among all potential users
[11:05] Andrew Hellershanks: Hello, Arielle. Hello, Kayaker.
[11:05] Kayaker Magic: I am running on a pre-release FireStorm, with a new cache to load.
[11:05] Arielle Popstar: Hi andrew
[11:05] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: that could explain a lot
[11:05] Arielle Popstar: partly gray Gavin?
[11:06] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: not today, but usually yes
[11:06] Arielle Popstar: not wearing anything i havent before
[11:07] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: maybe Ubit did something to the simulator
[11:07] Kayaker Magic: Arielle, you will be happy to hear that all your clothes rezzed first, body arriving now...
[11:07] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: I mean he has been pushing updated by the dozen
[11:07] Arielle Popstar: but seems there are some issues for hypergrid people wehere there is a problem of one or thee other grid using port 8003
[11:07] Andrew Hellershanks: He has pushed a lot of changes this past week.
[11:08] Arielle Popstar: and what do they do Andrew?
[11:08] Andrew Hellershanks: I can't always tell from the commit messages. A lot of changes were related to the http server.
[11:08] Ubit Umarov: this sim is outdated, Bill lost in RL
[11:09] Andrew Hellershanks: Some changes were related to the Flotsam cache.
[11:09] Ubit Umarov: does not even show up at irc now
[11:09] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: but is he OK?
[11:09] Arielle Popstar: so maybe we need to move the meeting space?
[11:09] Ubit Umarov: hope he his
[11:10] Ubit Umarov: just that mindset change after his problems i guess
[11:10] Ubit Umarov: changed focus to RL
[11:10] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: I can see that
[11:11] Arielle Popstar: maybe he found dev meetings stressful
[11:12] Ubit Umarov: opensim dev issues are stressful and very frustrating
[11:12] Ubit Umarov: at least on ocasions
[11:12] Andrew Hellershanks nods
[11:12] Arielle Popstar: from a code perspective or an acceptance one?
[11:12] Ubit Umarov: well 99.999% of the time :p
[11:13] Ubit Umarov: that human prespective
[11:13] Ubit Umarov: thats
[11:13] Andrew Hellershanks: Arielle, sometimes both. :)
[11:13] Ubit Umarov: code is just code
[11:14] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: ha, try tell that to Visual Studio
[11:14] Ubit Umarov: can be irritating also.. many times pure Vodoo
[11:14] Ubit Umarov: but is code
[11:14] Arielle Popstar: its where changed code leads
[11:15] Ubit Umarov: garbage collector, a exception.. irritating broken crap all the time
[11:15] Ubit Umarov: why don't those morons add a optional FREE
[11:15] Ubit Umarov: damm religions
[11:16] Arielle Popstar: ?
[11:17] Ubit Umarov: garbage collector religion arielle, we have no wait to tell it "GIVE my F* memory back.. i do not want this anymore"
[11:17] Ubit Umarov: and it does never release it.. kist loses it in some cases
[11:17] Arielle Popstar: thats a linux issue isnt it?
[11:18] Ubit Umarov: don't knwo what option dan changed but LBSA is using 13GB of ram now
[11:18] Ubit Umarov: same code.. no real leaks
[11:18] Arielle Popstar: wow
[11:18] Ubit Umarov: just the crap GC is not working
[11:18] Arielle Popstar: does that help people to load faster?
[11:18] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: does he know what option he changed?
[11:18] Ubit Umarov: no
[11:18] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: oh
[11:18] Ubit Umarov: in many cases it is just lost memory
[11:19] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: that makes it more interesting
[11:19] Ubit Umarov: .net lost track of it
[11:19] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: getting senile...
[11:19] Ubit Umarov: i think it is related to flotsam files expire
[11:19] Ubit Umarov: that code is just BAD
[11:20] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: can't it run without flotsam?
[11:20] Ubit Umarov: ( and not that easy to improve it )
[11:20] Ubit Umarov: we can't run opensim without it now
[11:20] Arielle Popstar: what good is the cache if it doesnt help to load the people up faster anyway
[11:20] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: you could before?
[11:20] Ubit Umarov: been a option is just a trap for noobs :p
[11:21] Ubit Umarov: and NEVER use its memory cache, unless you don't mind to have alll assets in memory for ever
[11:21] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: haha
[11:21] Ubit Umarov: i should delete the other cache option there, that is memory only
[11:21] Ubit Umarov: again GC makes memory cache impossible
[11:22] Ubit Umarov: when it expires, GC just loses it
[11:22] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: we don't want to cache bad hair
[11:22] Ubit Umarov: dan made that mistake also on sandboxes
[11:22] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: hair and jeans with 200k tris
[11:22] Arielle Popstar: what makes it bad to begin with?
[11:23] Ubit Umarov: they where using tons of GB
[11:23] Ubit Umarov: so every thing ppl seen was in memory
[11:23] Ubit Umarov: in case od assets, i made that unreleased memory still work
[11:24] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: I'd been wondering about that when people say they have regions needing 16 GB memory
[11:24] Ubit Umarov: unCollected Hit Rate: 30.48% (1895 entries 5 alive)
[11:24] Arielle Popstar: where dos the xbakes pull from?
[11:24] Ubit Umarov: those 5 things are things GC should had released and didn't
[11:25] Ubit Umarov: but using weekreferences, i can get them
[11:25] Ubit Umarov: bf i added that code, that would be just lost memoty
[11:25] Ubit Umarov: bahh GC is pure vodoo
[11:25] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: is it the same on Win and mono?
[11:26] Ubit Umarov: identical yes
[11:26] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: pitty
[11:26] Ubit Umarov: and getting similar bc its all ms now
[11:26] Arielle Popstar: linux was always the bad one for GC
[11:26] Ubit Umarov: 6.10 was looking a bit better
[11:26] Ubit Umarov: before dan messed aroudn with flotsam settings
[11:27] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002 whispers: and he cannot revert the settings?
[11:27] Ubit Umarov: well not sure what he did.. need to wait he getting back from work
[11:27] Kayaker Magic: You did some changes to simplemoneymodule, moving the URI to the [Economy] section? NSDTL has always used [Economy], Gloebits has gotten the URI out of [Startup], is this going to require changes to OpenSim.ini for grids that have an economy?
[11:27] Ubit Umarov: it was this morning :)
[11:27] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: ok, IC
[11:28] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: never change yout settings in the morning unless you want to ruin your day
[11:28] Ubit Umarov: yes those settings need to be per money module
[11:28] Arielle Popstar: i got a money module warning entering here
[11:28] Arielle Popstar: that was a first
[11:29] Arielle Popstar: i think
[11:29] Ubit Umarov: now viewers can get a override for the helperURI ( that is land and currency handlers ) per region
[11:29] Ubit Umarov: well this is on older code
[11:29] Arielle Popstar: but i never seen that message here beofre
[11:29] Ubit Umarov: never seen that warning
[11:29] Kayaker Magic: Actually, the "different server" message says it was built today
[11:30] Arielle Popstar: so if older, i shouldnt be seeing it
[11:30] Ubit Umarov: this oen was built today?
[11:30] Andrew Hellershanks: I didn't see any money module related message when I arrived today.
[11:30] Kayaker Magic whispers: two hours ago, Bill's chrontab is working even if he does not!
[11:30] Andrew Hellershanks: :)
[11:30] Arielle Popstar: i did
[11:30] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: In region Dev Outreach at (11089, 10001)
OpenSim 0.9.2.0 Yeti Dev 09:32:50 05-12-2020
[11:31] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: is what the viewer reports
[11:31] Arielle Popstar: right smack in the middle of my window
[11:31] Ubit Umarov: he had stopped that crontab
[11:31] Ubit Umarov: well then we are on the new bugs
[11:31] Ubit Umarov: but there is a needed entry on [economy] now
[11:31] Kayaker Magic: New improoved bugs!
[11:31] Ubit Umarov: here at osg
[11:32] Ubit Umarov: like economy = blabla.osgrid.org
[11:32] Arielle Popstar: Yungster was mentioning the message too the other day in Lbsa
[11:32] Kayaker Magic: Ah, and the crontab isn't smart enough to read the git log and change the OpenSim.ini
[11:32] Arielle Popstar: so we get that message by default now?
[11:32] Ubit Umarov: but you only see things if you arrive from a region using money, specially gloebits
[11:33] Ubit Umarov: ive no idea what that message is
[11:33] Ubit Umarov: sounfs a FS disclaimer abotu $
[11:33] Arielle Popstar: i dont see a record of it now
[11:33] Arielle Popstar: could have been yes
[11:33] Ubit Umarov: i looked on fs cources but did not found it
[11:33] Arielle Popstar: it was fairly long winded with no spelling mistakes
[11:34] Ubit Umarov: it maybe a disclaimer FS ppl think they need because reasons
[11:34] Ubit Umarov: so be free from $ problems
[11:34] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: what is the exact message?
[11:35] Arielle Popstar: way too long for me to remember and i dont see a record of it after i closed it
[11:35] Ubit Umarov: fs blabla fs blabla blabla
[11:35] Ubit Umarov: :)
[11:36] Ubit Umarov: my changes where to suport that per region setting
[11:36] Ubit Umarov: to at least undo it when one arrives from a region with $
[11:37] Ubit Umarov: but there is the need for that economy = gridMoneyUri
[11:37] Arielle Popstar: is it possible using region code to steal any monies in the account?
[11:37] Ubit Umarov: nahh
[11:37] Arielle Popstar: for those that have a gloebits type account?
[11:38] Ubit Umarov: region code is a dummy
[11:38] Ubit Umarov: i mean the module we provide
[11:38] Arielle Popstar: meaning?
[11:39] Ubit Umarov: i can't speak for code ppl actually run
[11:39] Arielle Popstar: but the regions have some control over it?
[11:39] Ubit Umarov: security is a money modules makers issue
[11:39] Ubit Umarov: ( reason why we don't make one )
[11:40] Arielle Popstar: then why would you need to make changes in the region code for it outside of the money module?
[11:40] Ubit Umarov: sp ypu stop seening gloebits at lbsa
[11:40] Arielle Popstar: why would it matter ?
[11:41] Arielle Popstar: i sort of wish osgrid allowed gloebit donations anyway
[11:41] Ubit Umarov: outside the scope of this meetings telling those details
[11:41] Kayaker Magic: A completely different issue: I have been on some grids where I am able to get (unavailable) items when I HG to other places. I cant test the version I build for this because OSGrid doesn't support suitcase. Are there any known issues with suitcase?
[11:42] Ubit Umarov: think osgrid had big issues with suitcase in past
[11:42] Ubit Umarov: so now they refuse to use it
[11:42] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: I think OSG needs to keep a proper trail on their donations for tax reasons being a registered non profit. Mixing Gloebits into that equation could be a total can of worms
[11:42] Arielle Popstar: there was supposed to have been a HG 2.5 but dont think diva ever got around to it
[11:43] Ubit Umarov: possible 2.0 first.. or event 1.50000001
[11:43] Arielle Popstar: HG 2.0 does have a couple probs
[11:43] Kayaker Magic: I'm talking about going to grid X that has suitcase enabled, then I HG to grid Y that has suitcase enabled, then I reach into inventory and pull things from grid X to grid Y with no restriction
[11:43] Ubit Umarov: oops there is a 2.0 ?
[11:43] Arielle Popstar: there is
[11:43] Ubit Umarov: ok
[11:43] Arielle Popstar: or was
[11:44] Arielle Popstar: HG 1.5 was an interim release
[11:44] Ubit Umarov: well hg has tons osd issues still
[11:44] Ubit Umarov: ..of...
[11:44] Arielle Popstar: 2.0 was suposed to be final but there were some issues discovered
[11:45] Ubit Umarov: there is not "final" on those things
[11:45] Arielle Popstar: years ago the talk was to make the inventory travel with the viewer from the originating grid instead of sending it to the destination grid
[11:45] Ubit Umarov: diva is now thinking about creator rights protection
[11:46] Ubit Umarov: she opened a discussion on her blog
[11:46] Arielle Popstar: but that fell by the wayside for some reason
[11:46] Ubit Umarov: that of course i forgot the url
[11:46] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: it was the first post on that blog for years
[11:46] Kayaker Magic: I'll have to create an account on one Yeti based grid, HG to another Yeti based grid and verify the issue myself. I'll submit a mantis if I see the problem.
[11:46] Arielle Popstar: at the time the viewers url's couldnt be changed as Ops devs didnt have access to that
[11:46] Ubit Umarov: im very skeptical on those issues on opensim context
[11:47] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: http://www.metaverseink.com/blog/
[11:47] Ubit Umarov: thx gavin.Hird
[11:47] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: previous post was in 2015
[11:47] Ubit Umarov: a few days ago i tried to look to the uselss and broken export flag
[11:48] Ubit Umarov: but did gave up on it again
[11:48] Arielle Popstar: there was a big debate on that when Mel brought it up years ago
[11:48] Arielle Popstar: because they wanted to roll it out with default no export on
[11:48] Ubit Umarov: very good those debates :p
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: result was a broken useless thing now :)
[11:49] Arielle Popstar: which would have broken all the content out there already exportable and with no creator present to turn it with export on
[11:49] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: just get rid of it
[11:49] Ubit Umarov: well main thing is that Mel will veto any export set unless the item is full rights
[11:49] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: only keep the option to not be able to export anything from a simulator
[11:50] Arielle Popstar: Melanie should have gone with Kitely's implimentation
[11:50] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: or grid
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: easy to understand her reasons
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: but makes it just useless also
[11:50] Arielle Popstar: not really
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: kit allows now freebies to export
[11:50] Arielle Popstar: she goes under the assumption that everyone in opensim is a thief
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: and it is :p
[11:50] Ubit Umarov: ooops i said that?
[11:51] Arielle Popstar: not surprised
[11:51] Ubit Umarov: fact is that anything that hits a private opensim machine is automaticly a freebie
[11:52] Ubit Umarov: in same cases, worse.. sold as a original
[11:52] Arielle Popstar: same as s/l
[11:52] Arielle Popstar: nature of the beast
[11:52] Ubit Umarov: so bettre just allow freebies
[11:52] Arielle Popstar: but that isnt because everyone is a thief
[11:52] Arielle Popstar: just some
[11:52] Arielle Popstar: no thats is you dictating
[11:52] Ubit Umarov: ( im not talking abotu copybots issues.. those are other class)
[11:52] Arielle Popstar: which is a form of theft also
[11:53] Arielle Popstar: the options can be made avaialble
[11:53] Arielle Popstar: available
[11:53] Ubit Umarov: you still did not understood that opensim is not a democracy ?
[11:53] Arielle Popstar: of course it is
[11:53] Ubit Umarov: no it is now
[11:53] Ubit Umarov: not
[11:54] Arielle Popstar: sorry, it is opensource
[11:54] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: that is a novel idea Arielle
[11:54] Ubit Umarov: opensource does not mean democracy
[11:54] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: opensource is not democracy
[11:54] Arielle Popstar: opensource means anyone can change the code as they see fit
[11:54] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: sure
[11:54] Ubit Umarov: at most means you can chage the code to do it your way
[11:55] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: but the original developer does not need to change it just because you "voted"
[11:55] Ubit Umarov: but not decide on how original is
[11:55] Arielle Popstar: and offer it to those who like it
[11:55] Ubit Umarov: how original is, is not a democracy
[11:55] Arielle Popstar: there is a support aspect
[11:55] Ubit Umarov: well we keep getting back on this :)
[11:56] Arielle Popstar: you can make the code however you like, but cant dictate people use it
[11:56] Ubit Umarov: thats a consumers right on anything
[11:57] Ubit Umarov: but this is old thing...
[11:57] Arielle Popstar: looking at diva's post, it looks like it is going to be current again
[11:57] Ubit Umarov: ( i fact i don't see any opensource project that is a democracy.. and does anything usefull )
[11:58] Arielle Popstar: see this line:
[11:58] Arielle Popstar: Nevertheless, the fact that the HG opens additional doors for abuse has been a deterrent for commerce on the Hypergrid, so much so that we recommend “Export” only for freebies.
[11:58] Ubit Umarov: yeap
[11:58] Arielle Popstar: meanwhile an article on HGB that Kitely market has surpassed $250k
[11:59] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: when did it open?
[11:59] Arielle Popstar: https://www.hypergridbusiness.com/2020/05/kitely-market-passes-250000-in-sales/#disqus_thread
[11:59] Ubit Umarov: yeah seen that
[11:59] Ubit Umarov: but we are not kitely...
[11:59] Arielle Popstar: bit of a contradiction there
[11:59] Arielle Popstar: doesnt matter
[11:59] Ubit Umarov: possible
[11:59] Arielle Popstar: diva and mel are wrong in their thinkiong
[11:59] Kayaker Magic: My philosophy as a merchant on the Kitely Market is that my stuff will get stolen by people who never would have been my customers anyway, and meanwhile I am making money selling to the honest people.
[12:00] Ubit Umarov: we have our own prespective on that
[12:00] Ubit Umarov: also our target audience is larger
[12:00] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: I bet Secondlife marketplace does $2.5 mllion every month
[12:00] Arielle Popstar: opensim is meant to be a framework
[12:00] Arielle Popstar: for either commercial or free market
[12:01] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: actaully they used to say that the SL economy was about $500 million/year
[12:01] Arielle Popstar: Diva in her blog is turning into a mel
[12:01] Ubit Umarov: the rest of that sentence also stated that should not even do anything
[12:01] Ubit Umarov: just a framework for others to do anything working
[12:02] Ubit Umarov: that was never the case..
[12:02] Ubit Umarov: but it is a framework, also
[12:02] Arielle Popstar: oh blockchain
[12:02] Ubit Umarov: kielty is using it to make her market
[12:02] Ubit Umarov: yeah odd en
[12:03] Ubit Umarov: kitety is using it to make their market
[12:03] Ubit Umarov: so works as framework also :p
[12:03] Ubit Umarov: well
[12:03] Arielle Popstar: oh lol, she wants to institute witch hunts through blockchains
[12:03] Kayaker Magic: I have a quick question before the meeting is over: What is the resolution on llSetTimerEvent? If I call it with 1.01 or 1.02, do both of those result in a time of 1.0909 or some such?
[12:03] Ubit Umarov: the code changs last week, where around http still
[12:04] Ubit Umarov: need to check :p
[12:04] Ubit Umarov: if (sec != 0.0 && sec < m_MinTimerInterval)
sec = m_MinTimerInterval;
[12:04] Andrew Hellershanks: I wouldn't expect a two decimal place precision to the timer, Kayaker.
[12:05] Ubit Umarov: also since that is a async event, it depends on many other things
[12:05] Ubit Umarov: for example if the script is busy on another event, the timer one will wait
[12:06] Andrew Hellershanks: The default minTimerInterval value is 0.1
[12:06] Kayaker Magic: Yeah, I know, just using that as an example. But MinTimerInterval is the minimum time you can ask for, not the minimal difference between two times that producde a different result.
[12:06] Ubit Umarov: on a totally empty region, will depend on the threading timing
[12:06] Ubit Umarov: etc
[12:06] Ubit Umarov: so.. not atomic clock precision
[12:07] Ubit Umarov: not even pendular clocks one in many cases :)
[12:07] Kayaker Magic: I wouldn't be surprised to hear that timer had a resolution of 1/11
[12:07] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: broken clock precision hopefully
[12:07] Ubit Umarov: well from what i said, it can't be precise by definition
[12:07] Kayaker Magic: if I want resoution less than that I can switch to YEngine and use llSleep I suppose.
[12:08] Ubit Umarov: lsleep also has variations
[12:08] Ubit Umarov: teh script is placed on queue until time elapses
[12:08] Ubit Umarov: then is placed on exec queue..
[12:09] Ubit Umarov: and will run when engine can
[12:09] Ubit Umarov: so time varaitions..
[12:09] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: so it is more liek llMightWakeFromSleep
[12:09] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: like*
[12:09] Andrew Hellershanks: hehe
[12:09] Ubit Umarov: its sleepAtLeast
[12:10] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: but it might lseep in
[12:10] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: sleep*
[12:11] Kayaker Magic: I'm going to llSleep in tomorrow morning!
[12:11] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: it is good to have some randomness to it. makes it feel more organic
[12:12] Ubit Umarov: public LSL_Float llGetTime()
{
m_host.AddScriptLPS(1);
double ScriptTime = Util.GetTimeStampMS() - m_timer;
return (float)Math.Round((ScriptTime / 1000.0), 3);
}
[12:12] Kayaker Magic: I expect the timers to have jitter, just wondering how much I need to plan for.
[12:12] Ubit Umarov: this one has resolution of 1ms ( by definition)
[12:13] Ubit Umarov: Util.GetTimeStampMS() has resolution of a few parts of us
[12:13] Ubit Umarov: on machines with hig resolution timers
[12:14] Ubit Umarov: guess worunf 100ns
[12:14] Ubit Umarov: don't remember exact number
[12:14] Ubit Umarov: well thing is is on opensim.log at region start
[12:14] Ubit Umarov: thiink
[12:15] Andrew Hellershanks: We are at quarter past the hour. Any last items for today?
[12:16] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: There was a viewer update out on Wednesday
[12:16] Ubit Umarov: ohh i may had deleted that from logs
[12:16] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: nice
[12:16] Arielle Popstar: what logs?
[12:17] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: I have also built a railway through 3 regions
[12:17] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: tricky terraforming
[12:17] Andrew Hellershanks: Gavin, Do you have working trains?
[12:17] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: not yet
[12:17] Andrew Hellershanks: ok.
[12:18] Ubit Umarov: 2020-05-06 23:46:42,187 INFO [LLUDPSERVER]: Average Environment.TickCount resolution: 15.6ms
2020-05-06 23:46:42,188 INFO [LLUDPSERVER]: Average Util.GetTimeStampMS resolution: 0.000101ms
[12:18] Ubit Umarov: still there
[12:18] Kayaker Magic: cool!
[12:19] Andrew Hellershanks: On that basis I wouldn't expect a precision of better than 0.02.
[12:19] Ubit Umarov: no idea how something worked with Environment.TickCount resolution on windows before i did add the Util.GetTimeStamp
[12:19] Ubit Umarov: 15.6ms is just bad
[12:19] Ubit Umarov: think on linux it is 1ms
[12:20] Ubit Umarov: who took my cigars? gezz can't find them
[12:21] Andrew Hellershanks: Wasn't me. I wouldn't want them.
[12:21] Ubit Umarov: wonder if lbsa did reach 20GB now
[12:22] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: you can sell them RAMDoubler
[12:23] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: the Windows version was called something else and has later proved to ly increase the size of the swap file
[12:23] Ubit Umarov: MEMORY STATISTICS
Heap allocated to OpenSim  : 219 MB
Heap allocation rate (last/avg): 0.006/0.014MB/s
Process memory: Physical 433 MB Paged 0 MB Virtual 12972 MB
Peak process memory: Physical 448 MB Paged 0 MB Virtual 12994 MB
[12:23] Ubit Umarov: this region is fine
[12:23] Ubit Umarov: same code uff
[12:23] Arielle Popstar: lot less avatars
[12:24] Ubit Umarov: i think its the flotsam files expire
[12:24] Ubit Umarov: dan wants to run it there, bc all those avatar meshes and bakes
[12:24] Ubit Umarov: only usefull for a little time
[12:24] Ubit Umarov: arielle never returns to lbsa with same outfit :p
[12:24] Arielle Popstar: will it help people load faster?
[12:25] Ubit Umarov: no does now
[12:25] Ubit Umarov: not
[12:25] Ubit Umarov: idea is to delete old files..
[12:25] Arielle Popstar: so everything needs to be pulled from the database each time?
[12:25] Ubit Umarov: so disk does not get filled with trash
[12:25] Kayaker Magic: Pretty good meeting! I'm going back to work!
[12:25] Kayaker Magic: Bye all!
[12:25] Ubit Umarov: cya kayaker
[12:25] Andrew Hellershanks: Only pretty good, Kayaker? ;)
[12:25] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: have a safe week
[12:25] Arielle Popstar: tc Kay
[12:25] Andrew Hellershanks: Bye. Thanks for coming.
[12:26] Ubit Umarov: everytime you change outift and tp to lbsa, yes
[12:26] Ubit Umarov: it needs to get it from assets
[12:26] Andrew Hellershanks: Hello, Cuga.
[12:26] Arielle Popstar: but if i dont chaange?
[12:26] Ubit Umarov: but it is only usefull while you are there
[12:26] Cuga Rajal: Hi Andrew
[12:27] Andrew Hellershanks: Cuga, you are lucky to have come here when you did. We are all about to disappear shortly.
[12:27] Ubit Umarov: that is per date of last access
[12:27] Arielle Popstar: if i jump to lbsa right now, will i rezz to myself immediately?
[12:27] Selby.Evans @grid.kitely.com:8002: Must go-- bye all
[12:27] Ubit Umarov: that is why its damm SLOW
[12:27] Andrew Hellershanks: ok, Bye Selby.
[12:27] Ubit Umarov: and eats memory like crazy doin git
[12:27] Arielle Popstar: tc Selby
[12:27] Cuga Rajal: I've been meaning to get here earlier but RL has made htis a bad time I guess
[12:27] Cuga Rajal: Been wanting to come for weeks
[12:27] Cuga Rajal: thx
[12:27] Andrew Hellershanks: Cuga, the meeting hour was up about a half hour ago. :)
[12:27] Arielle Popstar: and where does the viewer cache fit into it?
[12:28] Cuga Rajal: Yes I know, 11am
[12:28] Cuga Rajal: Wishful thinking on my part that people would still be here
[12:28] Andrew Hellershanks: The last couple of meetings have gone a bit long.
[12:28] Ubit Umarov: thats the last end of the chaches chain
[12:28] Arielle Popstar: usually is as it goes overtime 75% of the time
[12:28] Andrew Hellershanks: Cuga, Did you have any questions or comments?
[12:28] Ubit Umarov: and caches..
[12:29] Cuga Rajal: Question about a possible bug, and general questions about HG inventory cache
[12:29] Arielle Popstar: the viewer cache should allow me to see myself immediately right?
[12:29] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: no
[12:29] Arielle Popstar: then whats it for?
[12:30] Arielle Popstar: Just ask the question Cuga
[12:30] Cuga Rajal: Updated to trunk for the first time in a few weeks, seems I have to toggle music icon to see stream changes
[12:30] Andrew Hellershanks: Go ahead, Cuga.
[12:30] Cuga Rajal: known issue?
[12:31] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: it does not just start loading any crap in the cache - there needs to be a bit of consistency checking that the data has not changed
[12:31] Cuga Rajal: all in group had same issue, wasn't there before
[12:31] Arielle Popstar: so it verifies with the database?
[12:32] Andrew Hellershanks: Cuga, it sounds like typical behaviour, afaicr.
[12:32] Cuga Rajal: Maybe I got luck before.. it used to pop up the dialog for stream change without toggling
[12:32] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: it needs to go a round with the db for the scene loading so it does not just load what is in the cache, but what is actually in the scene
[12:33] Andrew Hellershanks: Cuga, which viewer do you use?
[12:33] Arielle Popstar: so sounds like the viewer cache is somewhat redundant?
[12:33] Cuga Rajal: FS latest OS version
[12:33] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: it is not
[12:34] Andrew Hellershanks: Cuga, you could try a different viewer to see if the behaviour changes.
[12:34] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: it loads a scene very significantly faster if (most of) the scene is the same as what is cached
[12:35] Andrew Hellershanks: Cuga, Ask your HG related question.
[12:35] Andrew Hellershanks: I'll brb. I need to check on something.
[12:35] Cuga Rajal: I could, but same viewer before change noted; Also want to debug with viewer most visitors use
[12:35] Arielle Popstar: ok so if i understand right, the viewer cache is for the scene assets, not the avatar assets?
[12:35] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: that too
[12:35] Cuga Rajal: Fixing it for my people not just myself
[12:36] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: but even that could potentially have changed at the backend, although not particularly likely
[12:36] Arielle Popstar: i heard rumours something had change re caches that cause issues
[12:37] Arielle Popstar: from the backend
[12:37] Ubit Umarov: yeack made a silly bug :)
[12:37] Andrew Hellershanks: I need to get going.
[12:37] Gavin.Hird @grid.xmir.org:8002: if you use FS beta (or any viewer beta) it might have issues
[12:37] Andrew Hellershanks: You don't have to leave but I will say goodbye for today. Thank you all for coming. See you again next week.
[12:38] Arielle Popstar: tc Andrew